fuck me sideways

[labellementeuse]

OK now. Of all the characters in fiction everywhere, Hermione Granger is the least likely in practically the entire WORLD to change her name upon marriage. She is career-motivated, widely-read, self-sufficient, politically aware and ACTIVE, and for fuck's sake, if that wasn't enough, she's marrying someone with FIVE LIVING MALE SIBLINGS.

Why is my fiction reading life so difficult, people.

Second question: do I get to count novel-length fics as 'books read'? I just read an epic Draco/Neville fic that I'm seriously considering counting even though I've never done that before. Thoughts? It was solidly novel-length, though I'm not sure how many words (averaging out a few chapters I would say it's about 150k, which is nearly four nebula novels; HP&tDH is apparently just under 200k and HP&tPS apparently 80k.) So it's the same amount of words as a novel. And they were pretty decent words, I guess. So... well, I don't know, you tell me.

PS I really mean it about Hermione.

Comments

[kitsunerei88]

I really hate to bring up the spectre of different cultures, etc, but I would argue that all those things you said about Hermione, while true, may not necessarily indicate that she WOULDN'T change her name upon marriage. I don't know. I feel a little offended because when you're describing a character as "career-motivated, widely-read, self-sufficient, politically aware and ACTIVE" and then insist she wouldn't change her name, I feel like you are saying that women who do [choose to change their name] cannot be all those things.

Straight up, I am all those things and more, and I would change my name upon marriage if it were all that important to my fiance. Changing my name doesn't change me. Of course, I wouldn't do that for just anyone.

Furthermore, I feel like you're speaking from a community where a woman not changing her name is normal. I think that's great! However, in the community I come from (which, admittedly, is pretty much the middle of bumfuck nowhere farm country), it's almost strictly not acceptable for a woman to keep her own name. I don't know how it is in Britain. But here, there are many "career-motivated, widely-read, self-sufficient, politically aware and ACTIVE" women who change their name upon marriage. Canada is a progressive country; for example, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court here along with half the Supreme Court is female. The Chief Justice changed her name upon marriage. The only place I've seen where women generally keep their names is academia.

I think whether Hermione keeps her name has more to do with outside environmental influences than her personality. I also want to emphasize that whether a woman changes her name is a personal choice, and I don't think a woman should be condemned or congratulated on that choice.

[labellementeuse.livejournal.com]

I'm not speaking from a community where women keeping their names is normal, since that isn't true most places in the western world. In fact, I would venture to say that I'm speaking from a country that is similar in very many respects to your own (progressive social-ish democracy Western Commonwealth country with low population density and some disjunction between politics in the city centres and politics in the country) as well as similar-ish to the UK, although I can't hunt down statistics to the number of women who choose to change their names upon marriage in either country.

My little list of traits of Hermione is intended to suggest that people with these traits are unlikely to change their name. As I explained in a bit more detail in comments to this post on dreamwidth (http://labellementeuse.dreamwidth.org/) (there's also some discussion there about changing names in women of Chinese descent), I know that there are women who are all these things that do choose to change their name. However, in my experience (by which I mean talking to a lot of women in communities all over the internets - i.e. mostly from the USA, a country more conservative than either of ours) women like this who do change their names experience it as a decision, not as an inevitability, and they will typically justify their decision in an argument - as you did when you said 'I would change my name upon marriage if it were all that important to my fiance.' Whereas when I see this in fic one of two things happen: either it is portrayed as an inevitability rather than a decision, which I think is frankly thoughtless and totally ridiculous considering the general Hermione-ness of Hermione; or they give a reason which is, indeed, something like 'it's so important to Ron.' And then I think to myself: we don't have information from Ron about this. I don't think it's completely out of character, but I also don't think that it's something intrinsic or obvious. Why would a fic writer choose to give Ron this conservative, selfish trait when he's marrying someone who he must be aware is not a conservative person? Since Ron isn't actually a real person, and all. I find I generally do not enjoy the answers I produce to that question.

[labellementeuse.livejournal.com]

I also want to emphasize that whether a woman changes her name is a personal choice, and I don't think a woman should be condemned or congratulated on that choice.

I agree that it's a choice, and I don't think I was judging Hermione in my post, I think I was judging people who write Hermione. However, since you bring it up, I do happen to think that women who choose to change their names are perpetuating some fairly conservative social ideas about women, men, marriage, and the family, and I feel no compunction in saying that I think you should have a good reason to do that. Being in love with someone for whom it is a dealbreaker does, in my opinion, constitute a good reason, although keeping my name would be a dealbreaker for me. However, I don't think people get to hide behind choice as a justification for doing whatever they want and pretending that their actions don't affect others. The personal is political.

[kitsunerei88]

I see your point. I don't read fic, so I can't really comment on HP fic at all (mostly anything I've read dates back about eight years and comes from the horror-pit known as fanfiction.net), but your points re: Hermione are good ones.

I don't think Ron would care, one way or another. Ron doesn't come off as a particularly stubborn person compared to Hermione, I don't think.

I think it's something so ingrained in Western culture that fic writers just don't think about it. In the future I think I will always ask women I know why they are changing their names if they do so. I am always secretly looking to make people think.

I understand the point between personal/political, but it's a hard balance to work with. At this point I make what small changes I can without jeopardizing my entire career. I hate politics. Thank god I don't live in the southern states.