(no subject)

[labellementeuse]

Wow, am I blown away by the number of people who think John was right to say what he said to Teyla, and/or people who think Teyla was in the wrong.

Now, okay. I can just about see that you could think Teyla was endangering her baby, if you are very pro-life and so forth - although, seriously, I don't think anyone can be more concerned about the welfare of Teyla's child than Teyla herself. Also, I fundamentally disagree with that perspective, because I basically think Teyla was not taking any chances with her child that she wasn't taking with herself - I bet she's checked with Keller, and also the thing is, at three months pregnant women aren't china freakin' dolls - I mean, a bump on the head is probably not going to cause a miscarriage. [ETA: I should amend this because it's not strictly correct: the first trimester is the period where natural miscarriages are most likely to occur, and I'm aware of that.] Being badly beaten could, being shot in the stomach could, but well - these are things that affect Teyla's welfare almost as much. Additionally, from the missions we saw Teyla go on in the episode, most of them were low-danger reconnaissance/evacuation missions. Not only are these less likely to involve violence, but they were also missions in which Teyla was absolutely necessary, not as a military presence but as a diplomat.

OK, that was incoherent, but you get my gist. Anyway, I don't think Teyla was taking unnecessary risks for her baby, but at least that position is semi-coherent and consistent (provided you are also pro-life.)

HOWEVER. John does not get to be the guy to tell her that, any more than he should get to be the guy to tell her whether or not to get an abortion, or whether or not to drink or smoke (not during pregnancy, I mean in general). Or whatever. It's none of John's fucking business.

AND THEN I keep seeing comments where people say that Teyla should have "informed" John as soon as she knew, on account of how she's endangering herself and her team.

!!!!!!!!!!!!

Okay. EVEN IF you buy that being three months pregnant really, truly, seriously affects anyone's ability to do their job (which, I think you will find, most workplaces do not, which is why most women don't take leave from work until much later in their pregnancy, and so on) EVEN THEN, all Teyla has a responsibility to do is to tell John that she's not feeling too well. That is all. I mean, this whole debate is coloured by the fact that pregnancies proceed differently for everyone, they vary from pregnancy to pregnancy - I mean, if we were talking about someone who was fragile, or if we had been shown that Teyla was unwell beyond a bit of morning sickness, then okay, I might buy that. But we haven't been shown that. We've seen that Teyla has been feeling a bit off-colour for a week or two, a fact of which John is pretty clearly aware - I mean, she's not wandering around pretending to be superwoman. I find it hard to imagine Teyla (or anyone on the team, see: Irresistable) taking weeks off for a cold.

I mean. *frustrated handwaving* ARGH OMG. IS THIS NOT ONE BIG RE-HASH OF THE INCAPABLE WEAK PREGNANT WOMAN ALL OVER AGAIN? ARE WE SERIOUSLY HAVING THIS DEBATE IN THIS MASSIVELY FEMALE-DOMINATED SPACE? HOLY SHIT Y'ALL.

I mean, do not get me wrong: I think John's behaviour was perfectly in character, but I also think it was assholish and Teyla was not recklessly endangering anyone.

Comments

[sixth-light.livejournal.com]

Side-note: It's entirely possible for people to not even know they're pregnant at three months. That's how little it can affect a woman. Besides, most first-trimester miscarriages just happen; they are very rarely caused by physical trauma. You have to be reasonably advanced for that to be a problem, or the physical trauma to involve, as you suggest, being shot in the stomach.

On a more general note - taking away female agency much? Because of course no woman (especially no woman who has been shown to be intelligent, thoughtful, and completely capable of taking care of herself) can ever judge what is safe for her to do while pregnant. *headdesk* It's the same old trope - the moment a woman is pregnant, she is nothing more than an incubator for the precious, precious fetus, and it is her duty to sit very still and not let anything happen to it for nine months.

God, I get so sick of the way society assumes women are totally incapable of doing anything but being pregnant the minute they become pregnant. And assumes that the pregnancy is, as soon as it is known about, vastly more important than the pregnant woman herself.

[megaffe.livejournal.com]

In addition to your points - all of which I strongly agree with - we have the fact that Teyla comes from a very different cultur to ours. A culture which is closer to subsistance living and clearly harder for all. In this kind of enviroment they are likely to treat pregnancies as not such a big deal. In some cultures women labour in fields up to their due date. - In other words John's behaviour was not just completey out of line in our own judgment, but also shows no apreciation for what Teyla's people, and Teyla herself, might expect of her when pregnant.