(no subject)

[labellementeuse]

And. Oh. I forgot:

THE CIVIL UNION BILL is being voted on today. I'm not sure what I should advise you to do about this. Just, you know, be aware: second hearing, woo.

I made a craptastic icon awhile ago... *goes to dig it up* Ah...



It's very... um, biblical? But I seem to recall that that poster was being waved outside Parliament last protest, the counter-Density one. :D

Slightly relevantly, apparently it's World Aids Day? Um, I totally didn't notice this..
... won't talk about it anyway, because lately everything I've been reading/watching about AIDS comes straight from the eighties and, er, it's probably be all out of date.

Comments

[greycolourgirl.livejournal.com]

OMG, you're completely right! And I had forgotten! 0_0
*plans to watch news very intently tonight*

[cabaiste84.livejournal.com]

For what it's worth, I do hope it goes ahead. I am a Christian, as you know, but I've never really seen the sin in two people of the same sex being in love with one another, and they should be allowed to be recognised in the eyes of the law. Personally, I think they should just go ahead and legalise hommosexual marriage full stop...but oh well, looks like this is as close as we're gonna get.

[disturbed-kiwi.livejournal.com]

Likewise on the christian front. I don't know exactly what the spiritual rules are but I don't think they should affect a government trying to watch out for everyone in under its protection.

I may decide that gay is teh EVIL!!1!!1! But I'll try and tell people why, I won't force them to stop.

[cabaiste84.livejournal.com]

You're a Christian, too? Awesome! Mind if I add you to friends?

[disturbed-kiwi.livejournal.com]

By Christian I mean that:
I beleive in the Historicity of Jesus as presented in the Gospels. I studied a lot before I decided this.
I try to read my Bible but tend to look for others to learn from (Real Live Preacher)
I believe in God. Based on personal experience and the lynchpin of my understandings.

But:
I listen to and enjoy heavy metal and dark music.
I swear. A lot.
I don't know if I believe in Hell.
I don't agree with lots of things form the Old Testament.
I don't think I have the right or responsibility to force others to agree with me.

So, if that's still all good, go ahead. I'm reading through your journal now, there's not many paragraphs are there? :)

[cabaiste84.livejournal.com]

Sorry, mate, will try to put in more paragraphs if it would make it easier for you to read. :)That's all cool- I enjoy some dark music as well (not heavy metal though!) and the Old Testament freaks me out a little as well, even though there is some cool stuff in there. I don't believe we should be forcing others to agree with us either- but try telling that to the Destiny Church people. ;)

[labellementeuse.livejournal.com]

*is not evil.*

..okay, I'm evil. I admit. That was a lie.

But still.

Also, it's so wonderful to meet a Christian who believes in separation of church and State in New Zealand... it seems to be such an item of faith (pun, hah) in America, but here we never seem to bother about it, which is a shame.

[disturbed-kiwi.livejournal.com]

If we insist that the Churches ideas must be law then we have the Middle Ages or Afghanistan in New Zealand. Either way its bad for those not in the system.

I'm all for the Church denouncing things they see as evil though.

[labellementeuse.livejournal.com]

*nods* agreed.

Hmm, yeah...

[miriamus.livejournal.com]

Hey I thought your computer had been confiscated? ;)

[labellementeuse.livejournal.com]

It's called "internet cafes."

And, right now, it's called "my mother has a guest and she left her compujter on instead of password locking it like she usually does."

[miriamus.livejournal.com]

Sneeeeeeeeeeeekeeeeee ;)

[mandor700.livejournal.com]

Oh, yea civil union! I hope it passes too though I would prefer oughtright homosexual marrage. And now I've gone and missed the news, oh well.

[labellementeuse.livejournal.com]

It passed through, apparently, and now just has to pass its third hearing next week sometime. *crosses fingers* We'll probably be seeing a bit of Tamaki and his Density followers for the next few days. >.<

And regarding mariage- of course, wouldn't we all prefer that? (Except, um, Brian. And fundamentalists worldwide.) But I guess you may as well support what this does since it is pretty good.

But marriage should definitely be in there, I feel. it's funny though how otherwise extremely liberal Christaisn, totally in suppor of the CUB, always shy away from "gay marriage..." not sure why that is though. :S

[disturbed-kiwi.livejournal.com]

I think they see marriage as a religous institution that society just happens to have picked up. Which is stupid, especially in New Zelaand where we have the non-nuclear, sprawling concept of Whanau.

That said, I don't think churches should generally do Gay Marriages because the Bible does have some strong words on the subject and the Church should have the right to follow its rules.

Unless their one of the Churches that has come to terms and decided that there are loopholes or whatever. In which case they should be proud to do them.

[labellementeuse.livejournal.com]

But, um, surely Christianity- depending on the brand- would view marriage outside the Christian church, ie civil marriage or which I'm fairly sure we have some variety currently in NZ- as, therefore, also a threat to the "sanctity" of marriage? And what about marriages in Hindu churches, or Muslim churches? Marriage, or a concept of it, is universal, not a Christian concept.

See, I don't think the Bible [I]does[/I] have strong words on the subject. Or certainly no mroe strong that on a huge range of things that nevertheless Christians today don't do. I think the individual Churches should have a right to refuse to marry gay couples- just like Catholic churches say no to divorce and abortion- but I don't think it's right for there to be a law saying so, because the interpretation of the Bible and of the various passages in under so much question. (And anyway, what there is refers only to male homosexuality and generally merely to sodomy, rather than the actual relationship itself... is it okay for gay girls to get a Christian marriage, or for guys to get married so long as they don't have sex?)

Yeah, precisely. Loophole churches. Right. ;)

[disturbed-kiwi.livejournal.com]

Yes, that's why I don't understand this argument myself. There's so many non-christian institutions exactly the same as what it calls marriage. Why doesn't it fight them?

That Catholic Analogy is exactly what I mean. They think those things are wrong and say no, as they should be allowed to. But protestant churches do allow abortion and divorce, in many cases at least. There are already quite a few who have decided that gay marriage/gay preists is fine, and thats good too.

Loophole didn't mean to sound negative. But there's heaps of them stren in that book.

[miriamus.livejournal.com]

I'd like to point out, re the singling out of same-sex unions as devaluing marriage - those who marry and divorce on a whim are devaluing marriage far more, by reducing what is meant to be a lifelong commitment to a novelty that can be thrown away whenever they like.